Vendors wage turf warBy David Slade (Contact)
The Post and Courier
Friday, August 1, 2008
Grace Beahm Ariona Moten sells Italian ice in Waterfront Park for the All That's Good company. Vendors are battling over rights to sell in the area. 
Grace Beahm Dan Wilson Previous storyBecause peddlers don't keep moving, city might move them off King Street, published 7.25.2008 There's a definite chill in the air among the Italian ice vendors of Charleston. As a turf battle unfolds for the best vending spots, the city is playing a central role in the escalating dispute by enforcing and redrawing the rules. And some peddlers think the city is taking sides, which the city firmly denies. With new rules pending that could ban licensed, roving peddlers from King Street, a related fight unfolded in Municipal Court on Thursday over peddling at Waterfront Park. Municipal Court Judge Steven Steinert had dismissed a ticket Monday issued to Dan Wilson, a peddler charged with violating an existing ban on sidewalk sales around Waterfront Park. There is a difference between peddlers who must move from site to site and those who buy business licenses for a year-long spot. Steinert tossed the ticket after Wilson showed him a city-issued map indicating sales by the park were allowed. The decision prompted the city to dispatch a legal team and ask the judge to reconsider the ruling immediately. A lawyer for the city, Tim Domin, said Steinert's decision could allow peddlers to flout the city ordinance until their annual permits expire. Domin said the city's map was incorrect, but Wilson had been notified of the error. Steinert said it seemed to him the city was "coming down like a ton of bricks" on Wilson and seemed to be "overreaching." "I know it's not fashionable these days to worry about individual rights, but I'm from the old school," he told Domin. Steinert said even city enforcement officials seemed confused about the regulations, and Wilson had relied on information provided by the city. The city says it's restrictions on peddling are a public safety issue, aimed at keeping bicycle-mounted vending carts off crowded sidewalks. The restrictions also are important, however, to the vendors who pay up to $10,000 to lease a location from the city, in places including Waterfront Park. Wilson thinks the city is doing the bidding of one of those vendors, his Italian ice rival and "nemesis" Dave Landy. "They are protecting his interests," said Wilson. Landy's company leases the spot inside the Waterfront Park. "The city is in no way doing the bidding of Mr. Landy," Domin told Steinert on Thursday. On Monday, Steinert not only dismissed the ticket against Wilson but decided that Landy had been harassing him and ordered that Landy stop calling the police about Wilson. The city has asked Steinert to also reconsider that decision. Landy is officially not a party to the dispute and did not attend either court hearing. "I'm not really involved in this thing," Landy said Thursday. "I just told the city, 'Hey, I'm spending all this money and you're not protecting my location' " On Thursday, Domin had some difficulty convincing Steinert that there was a serious issue at stake, if some peddler restrictions could not be enforced until next year. "What's the big deal," Steinert asked Domin. "I don't see it." Domin said it would be a breakdown of the legal system if businesses were allowed to ignore an ordinance because they were given incorrect information by mistake. It's a slippery slope, said Domin, to allow a "he told me I could do it" defense. Matt Gryder, who operates a peddler cart selling drinks, said he's also been the subject of complaints to the police and relies upon the same city- provided map that says the street by Waterfront Park is fair game. Steinert didn't immediately rule on the city's motions. Domin said he didn't know whether the city would ticket Wilson again if he continues to operate by the park, while Steinert's decision is pending. City Council is scheduled for a final vote on the King Street peddling ban in August. Reach David Slade at 937-5552 or dslade@postand courier.com. |
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Comments
This article has 77 comment(s)
Posted by zoomru on August 1, 2008 at 2:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)
For the love of GOD !!
We have ENERGY to produce in this state PEOPLE !!
We have people throwing BUGGERS over ICE?? Why don't we just get Myrtle Beach's "SNOW PLOWS" down here!!
http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/news/lo...
Hey JUDGE !! DO YOU SEE ANY WINDFARMS ?? Have you ever been to the beach and felt the WIND?? Talk about protecting interests?? You need to toss out some knucklehead legislators !!!
Hey JUDGE !! Why don't you protect US by having GINN Co. clean up the LANDFILL that is UNDER the PROMENADE !! You ..SIR! Need to go to www.startech.net and have yourself a DEPOSITION !! The PLASMA machines would also CLOSE down the MONTENAY incinerator and the BEES FERRY LANDFILL...FOREVER!! How would YOU rule knowing that MONTENAY is getting ready to bid for 20 MORE YEARS when we have technology right NOW to SOLVE OUR TRASH PROBLEM??
ARE YOU A LEADER?
Judge Stienert.....WAKE UP!!!
Posted by Neponset on August 1, 2008 at 5:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Where did this judge come from? Looks like he is not playing ball with joe.
Posted by Thomas1776 on August 1, 2008 at 5:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Sheeeehus!!! Doesn't the City of Charleston have better things to be concerned about?
Ban all the guided tour groups on the sidewalks. I am sick and tired of them blocking every single inch of space in my path and they refuse to make a hole for anyone to get through! And then these stinky tour buses that travel at a snails pace and stop and go and stop and go ... get rid of them, too! They slow done traffic which leads to more expensive gasoline being burned up for nothing - not to mention the flumes!
Riley picking on peddlers is totally pathetic! Perhaps demonstrations and demands that he resign are in order. Can you imagine the student body from the College of Charleston marching in front of City Hall? The City's lawyer is a jerk.
Posted by Thomas1776 on August 1, 2008 at 5:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Dave Landy has likely subjected himself to possibly being arrested for harassment. He has that hanging over his head for a couple of years till the statute of limitations expire.
It would be very foolish of the City of Charleston to ticket Mr. Wilson again, also. What's Riley going to do now? Threaten or try to intimidate Judge Steinert. There is nothing I would love more than for the City to do that to Judge Steinert. Riley would be arrested by the feds in seconds.
Posted by Thomas1776 on August 1, 2008 at 6 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Neponset,
Be thankful we have this Judge who is by all means "Honorable" and fair. He is obviously obedient to the laws.
God Bless Judge Steinert.
Posted by ForPnC on August 1, 2008 at 6:08 a.m. (Suggest removal)
"Ban all the guided tour groups on the sidewalks."
Thomas - Extremely, totally, 100% agree! These people are the most bothersome of anyone downtown and I am NOT nice to them.
Posted by Neponset on August 1, 2008 at 6:34 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Thomas
I am.
The sad thing about this article is that folks are fighting over scraps (little p*** ant businesses) when good jobs and business opportunities would be available if we could start drilling - I hope there is some oil and gas off shore.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 6:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I just don't understand why a city the size of Charleston is so worried about ice cream vendors. Both of them pay to have licenses, so the city's getting their money (they set the rates!) and the vendors get to make their money from the public. Who cares where they peddle!
That should be the end of the story...
Posted by zoomru on August 1, 2008 at 7:10 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Thomas1776.....
Yes ..it seems by this article that Judge Stienert proceeded accordingly.
However...I HOPE he doesn't let this blow up and then have Mayor Riley actually make a FOOL out of HIM !!
Fighting over ICE??
I wonder if they are using that BIG fancy ICE machine down at the MARITIME CENTER.....I think that thing can make 20 thousand lbs of ice a day?!!
Talk about italian ICE?? Wholly..MR Freeze !
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 7:16 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Judge Steinert...WONDERFUL judge. Very fair and he does follow the law. But he's also human, and he has no problem telling you that when he takes off that robe, he's Mr. Steinert.
Good job (as always) Judge Steinert. I don't see what the huge deal is, let these people make some money! Tackle some real issues!
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 7:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Good idea Gadsden...get a venue going to produce revenue for the city with sponsored fights between competing companies.
But boxing isn't for everyone, contenders and spectators alike.
Hot dog vendors could have a hot dog eating contest. Whoever eats the most gets to keep his/her license and plot of walking path. Loser has to pack it up and wait a year before trying again.
Italian Ice folks could stick with the boxing idea.
Prostitutes could have a sanctioned contest to see how many...
Well, you get the idea...
:)
Posted by EvilGenius on August 1, 2008 at 7:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I dont know...this could get worse, next thing you know the "vendor mafia" will be taking bets on Riverdog games and selling energy drinks to minors to get them hooked.
Do I really have to say it? {SARCASM}
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 7:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Lol @ Evil Genius
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 8:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Gadsden:
We'd have to be picky about the female vendors. Don't really want to see a "wet mu-mu" (sp?) contest with a couple of 350 pounders.
However, coleslaw wrestling...
Posted by ysillyme on August 1, 2008 at 8:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)
This is the blend that is needed; Have prostitutes sell the Italian Ice who are willing to clean up after the horse deposits in return for immunity for soliciting customers for later that evening, no need for a judge to get involved.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 8:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Excellent idea, ysilly...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 8:31 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I still want the wet tshirt contest. If you think about it, they'll pick the most attractive girls. And of course, who are you more likely to buy from? A cute college-aged girl of the larger, angry looking ones?
I like the judge's ruling on this. Does anyone remember when the city tried to make the little kids selling palmetto roses pay for a business license? They wanted these young kids to attend classes and pay for a license! To sell little $1 flowers.
And don't forget: the tourism gives alot of money to this state. Don't bite the hand that feeds you.
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 8:40 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Yesss. Unless for some reason they decide to buy a house here for the summers. That way, they can pay all the taxes necessary but we don't have to see them. And the minute they say "Well, up north we (whatever..) and it's so much better there" we deport them from the state.
Or make them clean horse dung. I don't want the beautiful downtown area smelling like New Orleans...
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 8:49 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Yes, but New Orleans was "cleaned" by Katrina...it's a much nicer place now...
NOT!
Posted by tripsa on August 1, 2008 at 8:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)
EvilGenius - "I dont know...this could get worse, next thing you know the "vendor mafia" will be taking bets on Riverdog games and selling energy drinks to minors to get them hooked."
As an Italian-American, I am deeply hurt by your stereotyping! LOL, just-kidding.
Posted by Larz13 on August 1, 2008 at 8:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Gadsden--"Come visit SC: spend all of your jack and then go back"
You forgot the "to Ohio"!
I would pay for a cage match between JohnQ and ColdBeer.
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 9:04 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I don't know how much better New Orleans can get. And, whatever happened to all the areas that were flooded in the northern midwest? That was weeks worth of damage and massive floods, but I never really heard anything about it.
Everyone just wait. you're so focused on Italian-ice and water stands, you won't even notice the taco stands coming!
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 9:06 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Lmao @ all of y'all!
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 9:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
nikkiP wrote:
"...whatever happened to all the areas that were flooded in the northern midwest?"
They are use to depending on themselves, unlike New Orleans where it's party all day and night and depend on the government.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 9:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Yeah, the only problem with the taco trucks is that sometimes you have to pick the fur out...
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 9:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
How could you trust tacos on a truck? Imodium would definitely be my friend that night if I were to eat one!
G-Funk (Gadsden), you know they have a taco truck at the laundromat on Johns Island on Maybank, next to the post office not too far from your favorite store, Hoggly Woggly?
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 9:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Hey! we use fur-free animals! It's just the beef hyde you need to watch out for. Best to go with the vegetarian alternatives...
I'm not gonna lie, I wouldn't mind a taco stand. We already have a few in summerville. They had them everywhere on the bordertowns of Mexico. Charleston sells Italian Ice, Mexican vendors sell grilled corn with chili powder.
DoaMM- oooh yeah, I forgot. I had an email that pointed everything out about those two instances. It made me a little angry.
Posted by coolfreaknbeans on August 1, 2008 at 9:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I read a book a few months back called Scratch Beginnings and the main character,Adam,ate at a taco truck here and was out of work for like 2 weeks!No taco trucks for me.
Posted by Early on August 1, 2008 at 9:27 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I say the vendors that have pretty girls that show some skin should be allowed to stay in one spot, I hate moving all over town!
Posted by CHRISJIII on August 1, 2008 at 9:29 a.m. (Suggest removal)
This is so ridiculous that it's sad. Leave the vendors alone!!! No one vendor should have a monopoly on any area downtown in which to do business. This city has far more important issues than this. How about keeping downtown from flooding everytime there's a rainstorm or neighborhood revitalization?
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 9:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Film your own local spanish soap opera. Those were huge in Texas.
10,000 illegals? Would now be a mad time to make a joke about having three houses for all those people? too much?
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 9:35 a.m. (Suggest removal)
CHRISJIII, the only way a monopoly happens is if the "vendor mafia" arrives (thanks EvilGenius) and takes over the area. Otherwise it's known as free trade.
If someone has Italian Ice better than everyone else and they are the only one's left to sell it, then that's not a monopoly...but the government would like you to THINK that it is...
Posted by ysillyme on August 1, 2008 at 9:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)
If the taco vendors catch on, I'm applying for the pepto-bismo vendor license, maybe even have a cute lil fire extinguisher on the umbrella.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 9:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)
ysillyme, I'll be your competition with the Tagament and Zantac trailer...
Of course we may be pulled under the law to have a fist fight for our territories...HA!
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 9:57 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Beans, isnt that the story about the guy from NC who started a life down here with $2500?
GDizzle, we have 2 pizza joints now! Lol
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 10:12 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Ysillyme and DoaMM, y'all need to set up a "Nature's calling" area fully equipped with lots of toilet paper, warm water, soap and towels...
Posted by MissPriss on August 1, 2008 at 10:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Early- you're a freak! LoL :)
Posted by ysillyme on August 1, 2008 at 10:19 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Tammie~
Do you really think real men use warm h2o, soap, and towels, after a taco fired bm? sillyyou.
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 10:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Lmao @ Ysillyme...
Taco fired bm..lmao!!!
I mean, come on! The debris is off the chain! How about the Lever 2000 wipes?
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 10:23 a.m. (Suggest removal)
You can market it to women, and provide a scented spray!
I wonder what guinea pig tastes like...
Posted by Newt on August 1, 2008 at 10:24 a.m. (Suggest removal)
The thing is….they do pay for a prime spot. Dave Landy forks over big bucks to have a location monopoly. That is how he can run off other vendors. You should see what he’ll do during festivals!
Early – have you noticed how the ladies have had to cover a little more? People were wondering WHAT those girls were really selling!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 10:36 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Why no sexy young men with no shirts on selling italian ice? Sexism!!!
Posted by Newt on August 1, 2008 at 10:39 a.m. (Suggest removal)
He has some guys...but none sexy enough to make me try a sample....of italian ice that is!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 10:43 a.m. (Suggest removal)
I've seen the guys. Like the one wearing all black in July as he stands on the street.
I think hiring by looks would totally benefit business. Forget that he'd be taken to court for discrimination. I'd buy from the sexy guys. Not to mention, he's paying $10K for the spot, and other people are selling there anyway. he should at least be able to hire based on looks and not get sued for it.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 11:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
nikkiP, Hooters does it. My cousin applied there and got turned down because she belonged to the IBTC (itty-bitty titty committee).
If Hooters can do it, why can't everyone else?
...and, if farm raised, guinea pig tastes like greasy duck...
Posted by coastal1 on August 1, 2008 at 11:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)
This sounds like the plot to a bad Mel Brooks movie musical "Italian Ice on Ice".
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 11:20 a.m. (Suggest removal)
"...and, if farm raised, guinea pig tastes like greasy duck..."
Eww..lmao!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 11:26 a.m. (Suggest removal)
not a big fan of duck, bleh. Now, about what chihuahua tastes like...
Yeah, but I still maintain that even Hooters needs to up their standards. They may have large funbags, but the face leaves something to be desired.
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 11:38 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Nikki, you are off the chain! Lol
Imagine a taco stand/italian ice turf war..West Side Story style...lol
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 11:59 a.m. (Suggest removal)
A musical gang war. the italian vendors come out with greased back hair, to some music that sounds like something out of the Godfather. the taco stand guys come out looking like salsa dancers, with some mexican music playing.
Yess. I see a Tony in my future...
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 12:08 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Lmao @ Nikki
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 12:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Nope, not this day-in-age. That would be a "Racist Musical"...
Even so, at the end of the performance, both groups figure out they CAN work together after all...The Mexican taco stands can fire up the crapper while the Italian ice can cool it down...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:15 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Instead of the burning sensation brough on by the aftermath of the tacos, you'll have the coolness of the Italian ice mixed in there.
If we have that good moral at the end, it'll be totally okay. See? they're overcoming their racial differences to work together!
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 12:19 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Make it into a Pixar film! Ray Ramano and Carlos Mencia for leads!!
Oohh, that's good stuff right there...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:27 p.m. (Suggest removal)
We can include more minority groups, too. Pixar loves that "moral of the story" stuff.
So we'll have a Tony AND an Oscar!
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 12:28 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Nikki and DoaMM-
I want my cut. Next up...Crime in Charleston, Cirque de Soleil style..
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:37 p.m. (Suggest removal)
For that we can set up a city, with people breaking into homes and robbing people all acrobatic like. The main plot can be someone running away while being mugged...
And then random asian gymnasts doing some crazy mess. Someone might have to be on LSD to write this...
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 12:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Lmao @ Nikki
LSD or on meth...Hell, we could get paid off this...
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 12:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
"The main plot can be someone running away while being mugged..."
...but he gets away because as he's running across the stage, the stage hands pull the guy wire catapulting him thru the air as he does flips and waving goodbye to the 2 policemen that intertwined doing cartwheels...
We're on a roll...keep it up!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:46 p.m. (Suggest removal)
it can start with someone just walking through the audience, looking sketch. We've planted our "victim" in the audience, and the mugger walks up and acts like he's robbing him.
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:47 p.m. (Suggest removal)
we are on a roll, holy crap. I think it's bc of the cake we had at work this morning...
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 12:49 p.m. (Suggest removal)
*folds arms* I still want my cut. Lol
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 12:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Tammie, don't just sit there like Ben Affleck, contribute something!
We'll give you the roll of the torn lover...you could even do both shows!
In one, you're torn between an Taco Cart guy and an Italian Ice Mafioso, and in the other you'll fall in love with the robber, even though you're father is a cop...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)
You'll get your cut! so far we're splitting a Broadway musical, Pixar film, and Cirque du Soleil show three ways.
I can quit school!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 12:57 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 12:53 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Tammie, don't just sit there like Ben Affleck, contribute something!
When I read that, I actually started laughing out loud. Around other people.
Posted by Tammie on August 1, 2008 at 1:05 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Lmao @ DoaMM and Nikki!!
We could also do "Riley and Mullen go to North Charleston"
(A spoof of Harold and Kumar go to White Castle)
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 1:13 p.m. (Suggest removal)
With the spin that instead of being high all the time, they're incapable of relating to the people of NC. And just looking for votes, not drugs.
Posted by letstakeawalk on August 1, 2008 at 1:22 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Thomas1776
"Ban all the guided tour groups on the sidewalks. I am sick and tired of them blocking every single inch of space in my path and they refuse to make a hole for anyone to get through!" - Walking guides pay a tour fee per person for the use of the sidewalk. They've paid the city to use the space in much the same way that your gas taxes pay for you to use the road. Now outa my way!
ForPnC
"These people are the most bothersome of anyone downtown and I am NOT nice to them." - Great, just great. People travel from all over the world to put money into our pockets, and all they ask in return is the ability to actually see the city by foot. Now I have to spend an extra 15 minutes trying to convince them that the stereotype of stuck-up, rude, pretentious natives isn't true!
Gadsden
"The guided tour group taking up saidewalks is no big deal - sometimes I follow along and get the tour for free." - That's the way to play ball! I don't know any guide who would complain about having some extras listening in the wings. They might ask you to step back, or contribute some $, but that's because we can get a $500 fine if there are too many people. I get most of my local business this way - they hear me on the street, they ask who I am, I hand them a card, and they call back when they've got friends or family visiting. You're welcome anytime!
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 1:30 p.m. (Suggest removal)
letstakeawalk- Exactly! I didn't even think of how visitors might view South Carolinians because a few people think they own the sidewalk. Now I'm kind of ashamed of it.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 2 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I just use my mountain bike downtown. Run in between the traffic, pedestrians, horse poop, etc. It's quicker and you get good exercise...as long as you don't hit a poop pile, that's bad exercise...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 2:42 p.m. (Suggest removal)
I thought about getting a place downtown just so I could bike or walk. Except to work of course...
I should get a bike for campus. making it from one end of the sprawling USC campus to the other in 10 minutes is a nearly impossible feat...
And hard, because there are no italian ice or taco vendors.
Posted by DoaMM on August 1, 2008 at 3:44 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Well, nikkiP, guinea pig and chihuahua meat don't have a lot of protein for the energy you need to bike.
Horse meat from those tours downtown, however...
Y'all have a great weekend!
Posted by common_sense on August 1, 2008 at 3:45 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Eh, you buy-a their ice, I break-a your kneecaps, capiche?
I'm just sayin...
Posted by nikkiP on August 1, 2008 at 3:54 p.m. (Suggest removal)
that line is going into our Broadway musical...
Posted by JW29410 on August 1, 2008 at 3:55 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Lets go back to the good ol' days......no vendor permits, no reserved spaces, just let them grab space on a first come basis.
Posted by dbenjam on August 1, 2008 at 4:09 p.m. (Suggest removal)
You guys have to realize that the judge is right. We've been conditioned to have the government tell us our every move. When the judge says he's from the old school he is talking about a time when we (Americans) had inalienable rights as opposed to state issued civil rights. That is the time that we refer to when we say "this is a free country".
Notice, inalienable right, you cannot put a lien on it. It cannot be sold or traded. Wake up people. Don't be deceived.
Posted by walleyedwoman1215 on August 2, 2008 at 11:03 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Tammie said: Next up...Crime in Charleston, Cirque de Soleil style.
DoaMM: Tammie, don't just sit there like Ben Affleck, contribute something!
*Choking, twitching, gurgling*
Please come and help me off the floor. I've laughed too much for one night!